//  More commentary on you-know-what, praise for OVToo, art vs. the
//  artist, another interview on the web, and the Kate Wolf tribute
//  CD.   -MF

From: BMiller224@aol.com
Subject: RE: Avila, Bountiful, the human heart, and other true spaces

Seeing some old-time NanciNet participants like Odddduck and Deb Thornton
posting the last few days encourages me to post my own thoughts on Nancis
recent letter.

I enjoyed Debs thoughtful speculations on the recent directions of Nancis
music, and what the most productive avenues might be for her now.  Deb managed
to find generous words to express sympathy for the emotions behind Nancis
letter without cheering her particular mode of expression.

Like many of her fans, Ive long respected Nanci for her abilities as a
musician and for the thought-provoking social commentary in her songs, which
she continues on "Other Voices Too."

And like a number of other longtime fans, I was dismayed by her strange letter
which she apparently sent to a number of newspapers in Texas.  It was quite
different than the other public statements which Ive heard from this
experienced performer.  It came off to me as spacey, mean-spirited, and self-
important.

A number of NanciNetters have praised her letter with enthusiasm.  I dont
think her well-wishers are doing her any favors that way.  I think this letter
just makes her look silly.  

And from everything Ive heard of her, Nanci is a woman who expects to be
taken seriously.  When I listen to her interview on Acoustic Cafe
(www.mlive.com), or think about her interview on her televised "Sessions at
54th Street" appearance, it reminds me how strange that Texas letter sounds
coming from her.  On "Sessions," she told a self-depreciating story about a
country record executive who had said, "Nanci Griffith has the kind of voice
that hurts peoples ears."  It was funny, confident and appealing.

This is not a teenage star overwhelmed by sudden attention.  She is a
successful performer experienced in projecting the image she wants in much
less controlled media situations than a letter-to-the-editor.

So when we see a public statement by her that seems so uncharacteristic, fans
cant help but wonder whether this was some kind of momentary lapse of
judgment. Which I certainly hope it was.  The closest thing Ive seen to this
was her e-mail two years ago responding to a fan who had criticized her on
AOL.  That was a bit shrill and also ill-advised.  But it was much more
understandable to me, because I thought the post that provoked it had kind of
a nasty tone.  And it was clear to what she was responding.

Im also surprised that there seems to have been a "gender gap" on the NN in
how people have viewed the Texas letter, at least on the list.  Women posters
seem to be reacting much more favorably, and the critics seem to be mostly
men.  So I may be expressing a "male" view.  But I have to think that public
statements like this will not help her image much with either gender.  Texans
"actually" eat their young?  With their "crooked, biting" teeth?  This is a
bit bizarre, and was clearly not meant to be funny. 

A few people have declared that Nanci has the "right" to express herself any
way she chooses.  Well, of course.  Nobody said she should be put in jail for
writing a histrionic letter.  But having the right to speak and saying
something worthwhile are two radically different things.  Nanci normally has
something to say worth hearing.

On 9/4, Cathy Welch elevated this confused missive to royal status:

(( Diana, Princess of Wales, lamented the perils of having become a smart
woman.  I'm certain some woman on this net will identify with this dilemma:
sit or shine? ))

"Smart" is not the first word that came to my mind when I heard the tape of
Nancis letter.  Princess Diana was very sophisticated in her handling of the
press.  I dont recall hearing of her expressing even her justified
frustrations at the press in the way Nanci just did.  Again, Nanci is a smart
woman who is also very experienced in dealing with the media.  She just didnt
seem to be applying her experience when she sent out that letter.

I for one would hate to see her trivialize herself by further public
statements like that.

Bruce Miller
San Bruno, CA

_________________________________________________________________

From: Jerry Enright (fasolaman@pipeline.com)
Subject: Re: Nanci's Austin, 1980-1997 and my midnight ramblings. . .

        My thanks to Cathy for her thoughtful post, which is finally
prompting me to respond on OVToo, pronunciation and "the letter."

        As one who considers himself old enough to know where the time
goes  :)  , I have to say that I like OVToo.  I do agree with Deb Thornton (and
Lisa B.) that it's not the Nanci album I wanted it to be--I still prefer LNGH
and Flyer--but that's o.k. It's the album Nanci gave us, and I'm sure that she
put as much thought into it as her other albums, but another side of her self.
And having seen old(er) friends disappearing beyond the great divide, I can
appreciate the desire to share these songs with friends and (also) respected
folk singers. Some songs I like a lot, others I enjoy (like Desperadoes and
He Was
a Friend of Mine) remind me of old friends. Some are "o.k."--pretty normal
for any
cd. Next year I may like others better, some less. 

        I don't have a problem with her pronunciation. It strikes me as
somewhere
between fun and Texas accent. Both BRFTM and OVT are tribute albums & fun
albums, 
and unusual pronunciation doesn't bother me the way it might have on some
other album
--though there are numerous examples in previous albums, ass it happens....

        Finally, I thought the letter to Texas critics was great. Way to go,
Nance!
Perhaps it was sent to one or another undeserving soul....  Oh, well. If
Nanci is
supposed to be more thick-skinned about criticism, what about the critics? And
who made the letter public? Not Nanci...  I'm afraid that my sympathy is
*not* with critics in general. 

        I don't wish to imply any judgement on anyone else, as we all have a
right
to our opinions and to express them, and even the most devoted Nanci fan is free
to criticize her--but I like the Nanci I know from her songs, and I liked
the Nanci 
I saw at the Rosemont, and I like the Nanci I know (however little) from
other sources,
so I'm pretty happy with whatever albums she gives me. If she wanted an
opinion, I
might (as many have) pick songs I don't particularly care for, or which
could have
been done a different way. Or I might wonder if that letter should be sent to so
many people (assuming she sent it), but I support her decision (and think it was
*really* well written!). 

        I can't imagine that anyone who is not really a Nanci fan would be
spending
time on the NN, so I  have to assume that the critics (on the NN) are
starting from
the same place I am, they just reach other conclusions. That's o.k. We can still
be "the nicest newsgroup" (assuming we want to ;) ) and disagree.

        Warm regards (as Shawn would say),

        Jerry

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: DLMTX@aol.com
Subject: Re: human heart, and other true spaces

As a response to Bruce Miller, who wrote:

"Im also surprised that there seems to have been a "gender gap" on the NN in
how people have viewed the Texas letter, at least on the list.  Women posters
seem to be reacting much more favorably,"

I have to check in on the non-favorable side of this issue, as if anyone
really cares to hear about it anymore. Perhaps this is denial, but I am
disheartened if it really is from the person I considered on higher ground.  

Now I feel nervous about posting for fear of having her find us talking about
her and start reaming us about getting over it already!!  I really want to,
because it has left me  feeling sad and wishing very badly that I had never
heard of the letter.

Deb " one of the many Debs" Meyer

_________________________________________________________________

From: ferg@world.std.com (Mark E Ferguson)
Subject: Nanci and the Scary Monster (Nashville)

Deb got me to thinkin', as she usually does, and now I have something
to theorize about:

I'm not convinced that there is a common anti-Nanci bias among Texas
critics, but if there is, it very likely has its roots in the feeling
that anyone who leaves here and heads to a place many consider evil and 
corrupt, i.e. the giant commercial-product factory that calls itself 
Music City (ahem!), is suspected of having motives other than the making
of good art.  There are surely many old Texas fans who wish she had 
stayed right here and not succumbed to the glamourous temptations of the 
big bad music machine.  They may feel that the continued ordeal of being
made over in various poses for each successive album, always under the 
subtle direction of The Marketing Department, has been a futile and 
unnecessary struggle which compromised her art (especially the enduring
part, her songwriting), and to have stuck with her Texan contemporaries
would have been much better for her and for those who appreciate her 
talents.  

I'm not saying this is reality, but it could be the thinking behind 
some Texans' less-than-awed opinion of our Nanci Caroline.


Your friendly Texas good-old-boy (no big fat hat, though),

Mark Ferguson
Austin, Texas
http://world.std.com/~ferg/

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: "Eric Hay" (ehay@gateway.net)
Subject: RE: Nanci and the Scary Monster

I agree with Mark's opinion that many Texas critics might have been turned
off by Nanci's departure to Music City.  However, several Texas legends have
relocated to Tennessee and continued to produce highly artistic and
critically respected work.  I know that Townes Van Zandt left Texas and
moved to Tennessee, as did Guy Clark.  Not sure if Guy is still there or
not -- anyone else know?  Vince Bell alse recently relocated from Texas to
Nashville.  Something in Tennessee seems to draw some of Texas's best away
from their homeland.  In Pueblo Waltz, Townes wrote "maybe we'll move to
Tennessee/ Leave these Texas blues behind/ See Suzanna and Guy."  But it
doesn't seem to fit the bill for everyone.  Of course, there was the
pilgrimage back to the promised land by the Outlaws (Waylon and Willie and
the Boys) in the 70's, and Robert Earl Keen's 1989 album "West Textures"
includes the song "Leaving Tennessee" with the refrain "the only two things
that mean anything to me are loving you and leaving Tennessee."

This is something that a lot of Texans, including myself, find disturbing.
I am fascinated, though, by the varying role Nashville plays in Texas music.
Sarah W., do you or Vince have any first-hand insight on this one?

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: Bell/Wrightson ((onemansmusic@mindspring.com)
Subject: TX moves to TN

I am not sure that it is quite as much of a statement as you may think. 
Townes, Guy (yes, he is still here), Nanci, Vince...may not have left
Texas so much because there was a problem with Texas as a "state of
mind."  It was usually a very practical decision.  There is a lot of
music played and written in Texas but there is almost no music business
done there.  Real business (with all the good and bad that that
implies).  If you want to make a living it is just flat out more
practical to be in Nashville where there is daily access to hundreds of
producers, publishers, world-class players, etc.  We've been here a year
and Vince has a book and a CD coming out this fall...that wasn't going
to happen in Texas, and we've been lucky not to have spent too much time
playing in the mud with the corrupt "factory."  The Texans still living
in Texas seem to be flying in and out of here on a regular
basis...Lyle's management is here, Willie's and many other people's,
Shake Russell co-writes here, Dana Cooper lives here, Ray Hubbard, Eric
Taylor...we see them more regularly here than we did living in TX!  

Although not a native, I lived in Texas off and on for twenty years. 
For whatever reason (size and variety perhaps) it is one state where
people seem to stay.  And it does fondly and with attitude, embrace that
"state of mind," "native son or daughter," and "do or die" attitude. 
You don't find that as much in other places, and heck I've lived in a
dozen other states as well.  Perhaps as artists it is necessary to make
the changes, shake off the dust, try the unknown.  The dullest writers
are those who sing/write the same song over and over, yes?

I am not sure that I would agree that Texas critics are harder on a
wandering son/daughter than they might be on anyone else.  Of course,
there is always the (usually mistaken) attitude that we "know" this
person because we have seen her/him grow for 20 years.  But I'll let you
know when Vince's CD comes out.  If they hate it I can blame it on them!

Oh, heck, the climate is just a tad easier to take in TN if you ask me. 
See, no mystery!

Labor well this weekend everyone, drive safely if you travel...don't
drink and drive! 

Sarah

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: BobbyK (bobbyk@connect.ie)
Subject: Finally he gets to hear OV2...!

Ok ..I know this subject has been done to death , but.....I have only
just got my hands on a copy so it is still new(ish) to me , and I just
wanna say that after playing it non-stop for the past week ( and driving
my whole family mad !!) I absolutely LOVE this album .....I know that
doesn't seem to be a common concensus among Nanci fans ...but what the
hell ...I just think this is a bloody good album that I will play over
and over again......I couldn't even pick out a favourite track although
I have to say that "Desparadoes waiting for a Train" completely blew me
away ...my background isn't really in folk music so a lot of the songs
on this album are new to me as are a lot of the guest artists appearing
, so on the foot of this I shall be searching out some of the people's
albums who contributed and I know that Guy Clark is gonna be first on my
list ( maybe someone out there can recommend a good introductory album ?
)  Ok , I won't ramble on , you all certainly don't want to read to a
track by track review by me....I've said what I wanted to say ....keep
up the good work Nanci and ignore the critics ....I love this album and
I'm sure there are thousands of others out there who feel the same ....I
can't wait to hear these songs live when Nanci plays here in November
I'm wishing my life away ...but I think it's worth it ... :-)

Guess what CD's in my PC as I write ?  :-)

BobbyK
Dublin,
Ireland

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: "Wm. F. Hirschman" (eteam@sunsent.com)
Subject: Re: NanciNet #98904

A quick deklurking from a fan since the mid-1980s and a fan of the NanciNet near
ly since its inception.

1) I know we all mean well here. This is a great group of people. I can't say 
that about some other listervs I'm subscribed to. But.... As much as we all 
want to know 
every detail of Nanci's life, some things really are none of our business 
(strange as 
this sounds coming from a hard-boiled newsman) and I think whatever the heck is 
going on in her relationship with her friends is none of our business. The most
famous people, even those who seek fame, are entitled to some privacy.

2) As a veteran journalist and critic, I can't excuse colleagues who tear 
someone down 
simply to build themselves up. But......Very few of those people exist. Some 
do, no question. But darn few. Unfortunately, like much in life, they are the 
ones we tend to remember. So keep in mind that Nanci has received scores upon 
scores positive reviews 
and outright encouragement at every step of her career from music journalists 
and music reviewers (not always the same people). She herself has said so and,
as I recall, publicly thanked two such folks in Houston who have since passed 
away. So let's not tar everyone with the same brush, campers. Yet another 
point: From a critic's point of view, 
the point is never whether you agree with the critic. no critic thinks that 
their opnion should be the sole arbiter of taste and culture. But once you 
have the critic's measure, 
you can gauge your own reaction to a piece of work by how in sync you are with
that critic. Not that this has to do with Nanci, but most critics truly yearn 
to hear good work and they believe slipshod, half-baked work is a waste of 
precious time in our lives and yours. Not to mention money. I review a lot of 
books and there are some volumes that are so terrible, so manipulative, so 
cynical that I can't bear to think of someone 
wasting $25 of their hard-earned money on such crud -- knowing that the 
author's mother would beg to differ.

Thanks for listening to the ranting.
You folks are the best.
Good thoughts for Nanci's recovery......
-- 
Wm. F. Hirschman       "I can back up everything I write half the time."
Education Writer                                    --Slap Maxwell
Sun-Sentinel                 "There are at least two kinds of education."
Fort Lauderdale, Fl.                                --George Ade

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: odddduck@deltanet.com (Bill Lukesh)
Subject: Remembering Neely O'hara

((I hope Thom's thoughts set a spark in those who will kick Nanci when
she's down (read: angry, frustrated) to go back to her music and
remember and feel what they love in her songs.>>
 I would be lying if I said I came back to the net with complete ignorance
of  the turmoil.  Nanci Griffith has suffered  because of the substandard
quality of her last two  releases. Don't get me wrong, I think a mediocre
nanci griffith album is still head over heels above most of the dreck thats
out there. However, its hard for a guy like me to ignore the inferior
aspects of the last two discs.  Furthermore, if one looks at the songs
included in OV2, one is struck by the number of morbid images included in
this  bleak collection. Yes, Richard Thompson's 'Rumor and Sigh' has more,
but we are talking Nanci Griffith here.
   Though it might be a different book Nanci is refering to, If any lesson
is to be learned from Thomas Wolff's 'The Painted Word" is that critics
should at best  be ignored. There is little point in showing ones anger to
the enemy,  whether or not the anger is justified.     My local paper, 'The
Los Angeles times ' is  known for having idiotic critics. The only thing you
learn from a review by the T.V. critic, Howard Rosenberg is how much he
hates T.V. The classical critic, Mark Swed,  has a neat way of evading the
issue of  how the music was performed at a concert. He talks about the
history of the music, and certain recordings and legacys, but when it comes
to the actual performance he is claims to be reviewing , he's mute. If A
'world class' newspaper like the L.A. times is known for its ignorance of
its 'review crew'. The  worthlessness of those writing for lesser papers
doesn't seem too far fetched.
   If it was just the  letter I could dismiss it as nanci having a bad week.
However things add up. She  seems to be in some emotional pain for whatever
reason. I'm still a diehard fan of hers. So for me to ignore the obvious
would be both a disservice to her and undercuts the greatness of her
previous accomplishment.   I hope she can soon come to grips with  whatever
demons she is battling. Hopefully, it will come before she alienates any
more of the people who have stood by her.  
Bill Lukesh

_________________________________________________________________

From: "Robert Pugsley" (RMP6@leicester.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: NanciNet #98904

Dear all,

1) Who is Ann Richards and why does 'zebraspot' think she's like Nanci (or the 
other way around)?

2) I disagree entirely with Robin about shutting the NN down.  I don't think I'v
e been reading the same list but what I've got from it has been(in no particular 
order), a load of artist recommendation, some intelligent and incisive comment 
on not only Nanci but
a whole range of artists (I even found out who John Tesh was!), tonnes (tons) 
of news I
wouldn't have got anyway else, tapes from around the world of people I'd never
heard
of until then, two bottles of beer and a Moonpie (still got the empties Shawn!),
 and just last week a NNer sent my son (who is nearly one for those who're 
interested!) a t-shirt.
Plus, and I don't say this every week, I've had my rather blinkered view of 
America (and Americans) totally changed.

So I say let's keep it going.

3) As if to prove my point, ladiez and gentlemen, I ask you to read Deb 
Thornton's recent posting.  You just don't get that kind of thing anywhere 
else. Glasses raised to Deb.

Thanks for listening, and Mark...keep 'em coming!

Best wishes

Robert 'If I had a hammer...I could fix those shelves' Pugsley


//  Ann Richards is a former Texas governor known for her sharp tongue.
//  - MF
_________________________________________________________________

From: GV (gvallest@online.no>
Subject: Nanci defense

This is one of my very few postings to this group.
(I'll probably get some nasty comments on this)
I have been following the 'letter' debate lately, and
I agree with Robin Winning who mentioned that this list
have changed to a list of complaints lately. I feel this
'letter' debate is unneccessary, it has nothing to do with 
my relation to Nanci's music. It was OK to post the letter here,
but it is HER letter and SHE knows best the reason why she
wrote it. None of us know what she felt when she did.
How do you think she would feel if she should happen to read the
nasty complaints here? From her 'supporting' fans?

Some of you that posts here seems to be very dissatisfied
with Nanci's latest releases. That's your opinions, I will
not trash any of her relases. I think 'Blue Roses From
The Moons' is a very good and strong album, and has many
great songs. I like it very much, and can't see any reason
why someone will trash this.
Even more of you complaints about 'Other Voices, Too'. I am old
enough to remember LPs, they used to last for 40 minutes. This
CD is 72 mins (almost a Double LP). If you pick the 12 songs (of 19)
that you like best, reducing it to LP length, maybe you realize
that there are many good songs on this after all? If the remaining 7
tracks were left out of the CD, would you then complain about it 
being to short? And wouldn't you be happy if you got hold of a
tape with these 7 unreleased songs? I would.

You can dislike an album or a song, but that does not mean you have
the right to trash it. "Don't criticize what you can't understand"(Dylan).

I subscribe to two other digests, which have some pointless debates
sometimes, but I also get updated and very reliable information on
tour plans and last minute changes. If anyone knows of an upcoming radio
or TV broadcast, anywhere in the world, it is submitted to the group
so everybody knows when and where. I don't see such massive complaints
as I have seen here.

Regards,
Georg, who is going to London, if I survive this.


//  Dang, there's another person who thinks critical comments should
//  be unacceptable.  OK, I mean it this time: no more negative 
//  postings!  Don't say anything that anyone else may disagree with.
//  Praise everything.  No matter what your opinion of Nanci's music
//  or public comments may be, you'd better say you like it ... or else!  
//
//  P.S.  ;-)   - MF
_________________________________________________________________

From: Andrew Layden (andrew.layden@strath.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Nanci defense

As predicted by GV, here are some "nasty comments" directed at his posting.
(Actually I don't think they are nasty at all. (But hey, I tried!) )

>You can dislike an album or a song, but that does not mean you have
>the right to trash it. "Don't criticize what you can't understand"(Dylan).

Aw, come on!  If I fork out money on an album, then I think I have a right to
say anything I like about it.  If I like an album, does this mean I don't have
the right to praise it either?  To have one without the other would defeat the
purpose of a discussion forum such as this.

>Some of you that posts here seems to be very dissatisfied
>with Nanci's latest releases. That's your opinions, I will
>not trash any of her relases. I think 'Blue Roses From
>The Moons' is a very good and strong album, and has many
>great songs. I like it very much, and can't see any reason
>why someone will trash this.

Regarding Blue Roses From the Moons, I wasn't a list member when it came out
so I've never spoken about it on the list.  I'd like to trash it for you on a
future occasion.  But for now, I'll just say that I love all of Nanci's albums
with the exception of BRFTM.  If people like BRFTM then that's fine with me.
But don't expect those who dislike it (or OVToo) to say nothing just because
they don't share your opinion.

That's the nasty comments over with. I do agree with GV regarding "the
letter".
It has no effect on my opinion of her.  To be honest, I don't understand what
it's all about.  Many NanciNetters don't seem to understand what it's about.
Even the direct recipients of the letter were apparently baffled by it.

On a more general note, I enjoyed the discussion over the letter, and on Other
Voices Too.  I don't see these as "squabbles" or "complaints".  They are
DEBATES.  Many of the postings on OVToo were thoughtful, even witty.  I like
the album, but I certainly wasn't offended by any of the negative postings.
 
People have complained about too much negativity on the list.  I accuse them
of having selective amnesia.  I've only been on the list for six months or so.
In that time, I've read many positive comments, full of praise for Nanci.

Yes, I've read negative things too (and wrote many of them myself), but
on the whole I think we have a good balance here.  Surely that is a good thing
for any discussion group.

Andrew Layden

_________________________________________________________________

From: c572559@showme.missouri.edu
Subject: Widening the circle

I think this may echo some thoughts recently expressed by others, but I'd
like to say that one of the things I like best about OV2 (and OVOR, for
that matter) is that these albums have brought to my attention so many
singers and songwriters I may otherwise have not encountered.  For
whatever reason(s) NG put out OV2, I'm grateful to her for that.

Moreover, listening to an album filled with people and songs that have
helped to shape NG and her own art--influences that have stretched for
years across her life--I'm reminded of some of the many places where my
life has come from, of some of the voices that have led me to find my own,
and of wanting sometimes to go back, to find parts of myself in people
who, some of them at least, are not here any longer . . . 

Thom  

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: c572559@showme.missouri.edu
Subject: Even Commies love NG!

Z Magazine, this way leftist rag which is near and dear to this red, red 
heart o' mine, has a nice review of OV2 in its September issue.

It says that OVOR "gave a mainstream audience a taste of the poetic and
socially conscious world of folk music" and that OV2 has the same
purpose and that "again the songs and performances are memorable."  It
goes on to say that OV2 is "a much looser, less personal album" than OVOR,
and that OV2 is "ultimately a homage to a community, its music and
history, rather than individual artists."  (Leave it to a leftist reviewer
to put a collectivist spin on an album . . . )  

Same reviewer digs "Car Wheels on a Gravel Road," "Mermaid Avenue" and
"Hell Among the Yearlings".

Z's website is http://www.zmag.org

Long live the Revolution!

Thom  

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: Mitchell (o416@erols.com>
Subject: Re: legitmate question

Shawn Kimbro wrote:
> 
 This is a legitimate question:  Is it possible to be a fan of the
> music of Nanci Griffith and dislike Nanci Griffith the private
> individual? 

Yes, just as it is true of any writer or artist or anybody who does
anything type of work or craft well.  

In some ways, isn't it more respectful of Nanci's work to respond to it
on its own and to "try" to stop fantasizing about some aNGel?  (Notice I
say "try;" we all focus on folks whose work we love and admire.)

What I think is unpleasant is if a fan who does dislike Nanci Griffith
the private person, something not at all under the fan's control, spends
time, effort, and space trying to persuade other on the Nanci net to
dislike her too.

Maybe I should explain that I've met Nanci the once and liked her.

Reid "all of whose fan's dislike him" Mitchell

_________________________________________________________________

From: Jerry Enright (fasolaman@pipeline.com>
Subject: Re: legitimate question

        Good question, but not necessarily the only one.

        I'd say "no," because I believe that Nanci's music--the songs she's
written esp., but even her choices of covers--flow from the person she is. I
don't believe that
she makes musical choices for purely commercial reasons.

        On the other hand, I believe that one can be a fan of Ms. Nanci and not
approve of everything she does or says--or sings, for that matter. Since I
consider
her a "friend" (in some loose, one-sided sense of the term), I'm inclined to be
less judgemental, or maybe to assume the best about her. Others, for
whatever reason, may reach other conclusions about her actions.

        It's all really amusing sometimes: Nanci is supposed to be more
thick-skinned about criticism, but what about the critics?  If they can dish it 
out, they should surely be able to take it. And I think that we could often be 
more willing to listen tp criticism without assuming the worst of her (or our) 
critics.

        2 cents worth...
        Jerry
_________________________________________________________________
 
From: Stanley Zucker (szucker@wavenet.com>
Subject: re. legitimate question

Yes, provided you KNOW (have met, spent time with, worked with,
interacted with, etc.) the private individual.  If your information used
in the like/dislike determination comes from third party sources,
including the media, including this medium - then I would have to answer
that you can't answer the second part of the question.

You could, however, substitute a phrase like "disagree with certain
opinions of" for the word dislike.

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: MreenParr@aol.com
Subject: The private and the public

Replying to Shawn's query:  >Is it possible to be a fan of the music of Nanci
Griffith and dislike Nanci Griffith the private individual?(

I think there is a hope or expectation in many of us that pieces of art,
music, poetry etc which move us must surely have originated in some sublime
soul.  We desperately don't want to be disillusioned.  We want (and need?) to
believe that artists who speak to our deepest feelings and emotions are
aNGelic, to use a favourite word of ours.

But, in fact, not only may this not be the case, it's very often exactly the
opposite.  Creative people are often difficult, moody, immature, flawed and
weak.  Now, I know this is a generalisation and I'm sure that the Nancinet is
peopled by highly creative and yet totally delightful individuals.
Nevertheless, high levels of creativity are often associated with all kinds of
psychological and emotional wounds.  Indeed, art of all kinds might well be
seen as a way of addressing these wounds, of an attempt at self-healing,
dealing with the pain.

Therefore, the answer to Shawn's very pertinent question is 'absolutely'.  The
art comes originally from an individual's deepest concerns but in the process
of being transformed from a personal concern to a public expression, it 'doth
suffer a sea-change/Into something rich and strange' to quote Shakespeare.  We
might respond to, and admire, the rich and strange but be appalled, offended
or disgusted by the soil in which it was grown (have I mixed a metaphor
there?)

Very few of us on the Nancinet actually know Ms Griffith.  We may think we do,
we may fantasise we do, we may feel that what she expresses in her songs is a
mirror-image of what we feel in our own hearts and that, therefore, she is our
soul-sister, but the reality is that we *only*  know the art and not the
individual.  If we did know her, we might like her or we might dislike her.
Either way, it needn't affect our appreciation of her music.  I know I would
have been vastly irritated by Mozart the private individual but his music is
sublime.  (I hope Nanci is duly flattered by being mentioned in the same
paragraph as Mozart; ditto, Mozart, of course).

Maureen Parr
London

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: Christina Ashley Di Gangi (Christina.A.DiGangi.2@nd.edu>
Subject: some random comments/questions (one form of delurking, anyhow)

I'm really enjoying reading this list.  Just a couple of "loose ends"
that occurred to me.

1)*Other Voices Too* is a wonderful album.  I particularly love the duet
with LucindaWilliams ("On the Wings of a Dove")--a perfect blending of
those two voices, one dark and one light, and both sounding (for lack of
a better word) like cream or satin.  Talk about another side of
Lucinda!  But *Other Voices Too* is getting equal play with *Car Wheels*
on my stereo these days.

2)what  makes "Ford Econoline" such a great song?  Plus, I can never get
it out of my head once I've heard it ...

3)I'm not so up on my Nanci discography.  What's the best version of
"Gulf Coast Highway" (apart from the Emmylou/Willie Nelson version),
which still occasionally manages to reduce me to tears.

4)Dar Williams ... I'm positive that I read someplace that she cited
Nanci Griffith as an influence (but where?), and if you listen closely
to the most esoteric song, she may occasionally come across as a Nanci
imitator ...  there are certain similarities of vocal expression there
... or is it my imagination?

Thanks,

Christina

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: Steve Makarsky (thekidd@flash.net>
Subject: Re: Nanci on NPR/Acostic Cafe

Afternoon, NNer's:  Delurking for only the 2d time... Thanks to those
who gave the "head's up" about Nanci showing up on both of these
programs... NG sounded great... Very up-beat and happy... Makes me smile
just to listen to her...

Which leads me back to the discussions about NG's "Letter"... Don't mean
to beat a dead horse here, but her attitude during the interviews sure
was in contrast to all the things I've been reading about her on NN... 

This is not a slam at any NNer's out there, but it seems everytime
something happens in Nanci's life, it gets a dark spin put to it here...
For what it's worth, I'm impressed she's put up with such critics for 20
BEFORE finally letting them have it with both barrels... I'd have told
them off long before then... The fact she withstood this type of
nit-picking garbage from people who obviously are out to create
controversy is another reason to nominate her for sainthood... I'd hate
to think everytime I lost my temper, that others would begin to look for
signs of instability...:-)

I guess all I'm saying is let's give Nanci a break and the benefit of
the doubt... She's certainly closer to what's going on out there than we
are... The best we can do is only second guess her actions...

As far as her "affectations" are concerned, IMHO she's either having fun
with us or doing it to get us to really listen to the words/story (or
maybe a little of both)... There are a number of her songs where I've
noticed she would either pronounce a word differently or use words that
I hadn't expected... Everytime she does this, it makes me listen closer
to the lyrics... And from the previous discussions, she's achieved her
purpose as a song-writer - it obviously makes other people listen and
talk about it...

As for her political statements... Well, she's entitled to her own
opinion... And if you start discounting artists due to their political
beliefs, you won't be listening to about 90% ot today's musicians... I
am not a Clinton fan, and it doesn't bother me that Nanci is... Freedom
of expression is what we're supposed to be about... ;-)

Time to re-lurk...

Thanks,
Steve "I'm ready for my abuse now" Makarsky

_________________________________________________________________

From: GPOConnor@aol.com
Subject: Re: TX moves to TN and Other

  Since I'm checking in after a lengthy period of lurking/nonsubscribing, I'll
offer my random thoughts on the following:

 - I say if you like the music then listen; if you don't like the letter then
don't buy it.  Lots of very talented artists are complete lunatics in real
life.  Sometimes a bad personal experience with a person can ruin a good song,
but then again, especially in the folk field where the text is more or less
accessible by the multitudes, when a real jerk writes a great song you might
come to figure that he or she's not such a jerk after all, or else how could
they write such a good song?

 - I wasn't too crazy about Blue Roses From the Moon, but several of the songs
grew on me.  I think that, for me, it will be one of those albums that I take
out every once in a while and enjoy, kind of like the way I listen to "Dylan"
by Bob Dylan, i.e., not, shall we say, the most critically laudable effort,
but a worthwhile piece of work from an always intriguing artist.

 - On the other hand, I really like the Other Voices, Too collection.  I
especially liked "Desperados Waiting for a Train," a cut that I noticed some
folks didn't especially favor.  For me, hearing it for the first time, with
all of those distinctive Texas voices interpreting an acknowledged masterpiece
of the genre, was a distinct pleasure.  It certainly is an experience
completely different from listening to the Guy Clark version (and, in fact,
prompted me to go out and CD-ize my Guy Clark version so I could listen to it
in my car) but it is, I think, a worthwhile musical experience of its own in
keeping with the rent-a-hootenany flavor of the overall album.

  I've enjoyed a lot of the recent correspondence, from old and new sources.

Best,

Jerry O'Connor

_________________________________________________________________

From: Geri Hutchins (hutchins@oasis.novia.net>
Subject: Recommendation --

A new artist for you to check out..
A few weeks ago on NPR, they did an interview with Ana Egge, a folk
musician from Silver City, New Mexico (my home state). Ana lives in Austin
now and has recorded her first CD  "River Under The Road"  She's been
touring with Shawn Colvin and credits (in the liner notes) Shawn and Nanci
as two of her influences.

I just got the CD from Amazon.com and I love it.  It has a bit more of a
country feel to it, but it definately falls into my definition of folk.

Dirty Linen gave it an excellent review and compared Ana to Nanci Griffith
for working "the hidden and deep lines looking for coal to make iron
of the soul".

She has some wonderful steel guitar musicians and in general the
musicianship is excellent.

Other than that, I'm not much for critical analysis.  Either I like or or
I don't.  In this case, this is terrific.

Geri Hutchins

_________________________________________________________________
 
From: Mitchell (o416@erols.com>
Subject: Suggested: A New Thread (and a silly one)

OK, folks, we're all too serious and showing signs of ill-temper.  So
imagine you are a Hollywood producer who has just obtained rights to
make "The Nanci Griffith Story."

Sudddenly, you remember that Audrey Hepburn is dead.  Who will you cast
for the lead instead?  What about Hooker?  Maggie?  So on?

There's no point to this exercise but fun.

Reid "boys just wanta have fun" Mitchell

_________________________________________________________________

From: John Hodges (jqhodges@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: Suggested: A New Thread (and a silly one)

Definitely the actress who plays Ally McBeal for the role of Nanci.
Wilford Brimley for Hooker :-)

John

_________________________________________________________________

From: "The Mont" (the_mont@hotmail.com>
Subject: Steve Gillette/Darcy Farrow

I'm wondering why the booklet to OV,T does not include a picture of
Steve Gillette with "Darcy Farrow"?  It does include one of Tom
Campbell, with whom he co-wrote the song.  But it's Steve Gillette
who recorded the song and is still out there performing it.  It
seems surprising to me that Steve Gillette would be left out like
that.  Does anybody know why?

Monte

_________________________________________________________________

From: KSandersn@aol.com
Subject: you da best

Thought you guys might enjoy hearing that there is at least one up-and-coming
singer/songwriter out there who is very much aware of all the great word of
mouth promotion she has gotten from the good folks of NanciNet, and that she
appreciates it. The truly amazing Kate Campbell informed me last night that,
and I quote, "If and when I meet Nanci Griffith, I am going to tell her how
important Mark Ferguson and NanciNet have been in spreading the word about my
music." Don't you just love envisioning such a moment?

Kelly

_________________________________________________________________

From: Ann Tyas (ann@awnpb.demon.co.uk>
Subject: OVOR 2

Hi you guys,
Just come back from British Columbia where I got my copy at half the UK
price. What do I think? Wonderful! I've played it several times and so
far my favourites are: 
Wall of Death-I'm afraid I take this totally literally as I remember
watching motorcyclists at the fairground when I was little
Who knows where the time goes
He was a friend of mine-I presume it's Dave van Ronk's voice that sounds
like thick black treacle-yummy
Hard times come again no more-found my husband whistling "I dream of
Jeannie" as this was playing and didn't realise why until he told me.
Deportee- makes me cry, thank you to those of you who put this in its
political context for me
Yarrington Town-I had this going through my mind as I woke up this
morning, a good indicator that a song has got to me
Desperadoes waiting for a train- did any of you hear the Highwaymen sing
this? What do you think?
Can't wait to see Nanci live,
Ann

_________________________________________________________________

From: "Bill Page" (bpage@scctel.com>
Subject: Nanci on NPR -- redux

For those of us who missed yesterday's All Things Considered interview with
our Nanci, you can hear it via RealAudio at the following URL:
    http://www.npr.org/programs/atc/archives/1998/980907.atc.html

Because of copyright concerns, you don't get the music, just the interview,
but man, what an interview...Nanci talks about depression ("I'll never be a
candidate for Prozac"), about riding the motorcycle of the wall of death,
about the Everly Brothers...she sounds good, real good. Noah Adams is the
interviewer -- as always, he knows the subject and is well prepared.

When you combine this interview with the Acoustic Cafe clip from last week,
even those of us who have hesitated to plunk down money for OVToo should be
motivated to rush right back to her this minute...

Bill "still a true believer" Page

_________________________________________________________________

From: "Bill Page" (bpage@scctel.com>
Subject: Buy this CD...

NanciNuts know that "Other Voices, Other Rooms" began as a reflection on the
music and life of Kate Wolf, the California singer-songwriter who died of
leukemia in 1986. Many of us who first heard of Kate through OVOR became
belated fans of the soothing voice and poetic phrasing that Kate Wolf
provided.

Now Nina Gerber, who musically was to Kate what Lee Satterfield is to Nanci,
has produced a marvelous tribute to Kate that picks up where Nanci left off,
presenting 14 of Kate's songs in new performances by some of the best folk
singers in the country. Kathy Mattea, John Gorka, Lucinda Williams, Peter
Rowan, Utah Philips, Rosalie Sorrels, Greg Brown, Ferron, Emmylou Harris,
Lee and Nanci are among those who join Nina on this recording. (Emmylou is
backed up by David Rawlings and Gillian Welch!)

I like all the cuts on this CD, very much. Gorka and Mattea sound great,
Nanci is Nanci (with Lee's sweet harmonies), Williams sings my favorite Kate
Wolf song...there's not a bad note on this disk.

Yet...and yet...after we listened to this CD, Amy played the "Gold in
California" tape I'd made for her two years ago...and we were reminded that
there is nothing better than Kate's songs in Kate's voice.

But this comes close.

The CD is "Treasures Left Behind: Remembering Kate Wolf".
It's on Red House Records, RHR CD 114.
I got mine at Barnes and Nobel, but I'm sure you can get it through Bill
Lavery's Village Records (http://villagerecords.com/) or from Red House at
1-800-695-4687, if your local CD shop doesn't have it.

Bill "no, I don't have any connection to the company" Page

_________________________________________________________________
Questions about NanciNet?  Send e-mail to ferg@world.std.com