xNanciNet/01821
NanciNet Digest 8-21-01
// Concert report from Portland...
// Some other non-related content, and (since it's a short digest)
// a series of exchanges regarding music theory...
// ...Enjoy! [BP]
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Subject: NN: Fine concert in Portland
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 11:02:45 -0700
From: "Musicant, Paul" (Paul.Musicant@CAX.USA.XEROX.COM>
Just a brief report of the fine Nanci concert at the Aladdin Theatre
in Portland Sunday night. In contrast to the Denver and SLC reports, there
were no picnicking talkers and no power outages. Actually, the Aladdin is
renowned for its attentive audiences who attend for the music, while quietly
enjoying their pizza, nuts, local-brews, and wine.
Nanci wore a black dress, with matching sleeve-covering top, and a
gray scarf. She removed the sleeve-covering, due to the occasional warmth,
as the air-conditioning was functioning a bit-warm at an energy-conserving
level.
The set list seemed similar to previous postings, although we were
treated to an encore of "Listen to the Radio", after Nanci coached the band
to the proper key.
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Subject: eBay item 1457230724 - 96' Nanci Griffith Taylor A
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 14:20:28 -0400
From: "Baird, Tim" (tim.baird@troutmansanders.com>
For those of you who may be interested, someone is offering this Taylor
guitar on Ebay - signed by Nanci on the truss rod cover. Thought I would
pass it in case there is any interest on the list.
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1457230724
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Subject: NN: Re: [NNC] Patty Loveless
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 17:01:07 -0500
From: Ed Maier (evmaier@dhc.net>
Ron Hennessy wrote:
> By the way, Eddie, does the mandolin purchase mean you've decided to brush
> up on your bluegrass skills?
Brush up? Never had any bluegrass skills! I think "develop" would
be a better word. I've played guitar for more than forty years, and
only looked at mandolins with a passing interest. Then along came a
Gove Schriver album followed by this Patty Loveless album, and I
had to have one.
Wandered into a music store last week and they had five to choose
from. Two were too expensive for my sudden whim, so I picked the
one which I felt had the warmest voice from the remaining three:
a Fender 52E. I tried tuning it like the four highest strings on
a guitar, but that was a fiasco. None of the guitar chords felt
right with the short fret spacing, so I went back to the G D A E
tuning. Now I'm learning all new chords. (Actually the chords are
quite old; the fingering is all new to me. (Grin>)
This is fun,
Eddie
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Subject: NN: Re: Bluegrass was: Re: [NNC] Patty Loveless
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 01:01:02 -0400
From: "The Kimbros" (kimbroj@charter.net>
Hey there Eddie -
Can resist commenting on your attempt at mandoliering. I played around with
mandolin for a while, learned enough to get by in a jam if there are too
many fiddle and guitar players about. It's a fun instrument but most people
forget that it's primary function in bluegrass is rhythm. (3rd
Commandment - Thou shalt not covet the role of thy brother the fiddler, thou
shalt only chuck the offbeat, and play lead but rarely when thou shalt
recieve the nod.) So, welcome to the world of bluegrass--for some it's a
hobby, for others a lifestyle and I highly recommend the latter. It's good
for the soul. (Yeah, even the part where you have to put up with in-bred
banjo players.) Did anyone catch the recent article about Ralph Stanley in
the New Yorker? Even they are hopping on the OBWAT box car. Here's a
quote:
"Despite bluegrass's mystique of mountain purity and Afro-Druidic roots -
what Monroe called its "ancient tones" - there's nothing inherently special
about it. Good bluegrass - like good blues, good jazz, and good rock and
roll - is sweet and sad, wild and sexy...."
Gosh, I think I've learned a new term!! "Afro-Druidic." I can't wait to
try that out at the next jam session or stage show. Lessee, something like,
"And now folks, here's a little Afro-Druidic number called Little Maggie,
neighborhood of B, boys."
Warm Regards,
-Shawn
http://mountainsoul.cjb.net
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Subject: NN: Re: Bluegrass was: Re: [NNC] Patty Loveless
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 14:00:10 -0500
From: Ed Maier (evmaier@dhc.net>
Kimbro wrote:
> (3rd Commandment - Thou shalt not covet the role of thy brother
> the fiddler, thou shalt only chuck the offbeat, and play lead
> but rarely when thou shalt recieve the nod.)
Aw, shucks. I *SO* wanted to be a lead mandolinierist...
Eddie
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Subject: NN: LBJ Button
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 06:20:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michael Wilt (handofgrace@yahoo.com>
Griffsters:
--- Bob McConnochie (rsm@ppp.com.hk> wrote:
> By the way - can anyone confirm that Nanci is still
wearing an LBJ badge on the back cover photograph? Has
she ever made any comments herself about
the irony of her support for LBJ's domestic legacy
(I'm making big assumptions here...) and the Vietnam
War/Landmine focus>
And Reid Mitchell said:
(I raised this question a while back, but got no
takers. A lot of those landmines did get laid on LBJ's
watch.>
I'll just throw these musings out (I'm not trying to
be controversial or anything): It's often noted that
while LBJ was a villain in terms of Vietnam, he was a
hero in terms of civil rights. The one doesn't forgive
or negate the other, but what Bob Mc calls "irony" is
just the reality that in a non-black-and-white world
we do sometimes end up with strange bedfellows. I
believe I've read somewhere that it's a vintage button
from the '64 campaign--Nanci would have been 10,
innocent and unaware, as most of us were, about the
atrocities in Vietnam, but at the same time very much
aware of the domestic issues and who were and were not
the champions of civil rights. Perhaps the button is a
sign of youthful idealism? (Maybe I'll ask her that
when I write the official biography.) The civil
rights/Texas connection would seem to be reasons for
Nanci to wear the button; it's one of those plastic
ones on which the image changes depending on how you
turn the thing. She could probably get a bundle for it
on ebay, but I've grown accustomed to seeing it on the
strap. . .
Meantime, I've just moved from southern MN to the Twin
Cities (new job in downtown Mpls) and am looking
forward to my first urban outing Sept 7: Nanci at the
O'Shaughnessy Auditorium (very nice venue). Just gotta
quickly cultivate a babysitter for my 8-yr-old. I'll
listen to "Clock" again when I discover what box it's
in.
Michael "drop by and you can help unpack" Wilt
=====
Michael Wilt
handofgrace@yahoo.com
"These days your face in my memory
is in a folded hand of grace
against these times." -- Nanci Griffith
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Subject: NN: Buddy report
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 23:20:45 EDT
From: GORDON1717@aol.com
> Hard to imagine anyone reporting what
> John Prine or Steve Earle or Buddy Miller is wearing for their concerts.
For the record.......
Saw Buddy with Emmylou a week or so ago and he was wearing jeans, a tee shirt
and a baseball cap. (Emmylou said she couldn't sing with a hat on like Buddy
does although she figured she could have made a lot more money in Nashville
if she could).
I am wearing............... never mind,
Gordon
Paul Musicant (Paul.Musicant@cax.usa.xerox.com)
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Subject: NN: Re: Big music words
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 22:18:21 EDT
From: ChocChippy@aol.com
>Ron -- I didn't think Americans would use the word "tessitura" -- I'm
>thrilled.
Tessie Tura was one of the strippers in Gypsy.
;-)
Kathleen W.
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Subject: NN: Melodic Resources
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 00:19:14 -0500
From: Ron Hennessy (rhennesy@coserv.net>
Donate von Bredow-Gardner wrote: (( As a songwriter myself, I know how hard
it is sometimes to come up with new melodies when you basically only have 8
notes to play with -- someone will always say "oh, that phrase sounds like
something from......." (I hate when that happens). >>
Hello Donate,
You've been so complimentary to me, that I hesitate to take issue with
anything you've said. I realize YOU realize that you're statement that "you
basically only have 8 notes to play with" is an oversimplification of the
true situation.
In truth, I envy you the fact you're writing songs and performing them in
public; so I'm not presuming to teach you how to do so.
But your statement about the limitations of writing melodies got me to
thinking about the topics of melody, harmony, and scales. I think I could
write a book or a master's thesis on this area, but I'll refrain from
attempting that here! I'll try to be as brief as possible; so I won't take
the time to define all my terms.
(As I write this, I'm listening to a fabulous recording by Robert Shaw of
Verdi's "Requiem," purchased at the same time as Patty Loveless's "Mountain
Soul.")
Donate, I think you were talking about melodies using the major or minor
diatonic scales. Of course there are five other diatonic scales. To
illustrate: the white notes on the piano have seven different notes,
excluding repetitions in different octaves. Any one of these seven can
serve as key center, not just the C for major and the A for minor. Using
one of the other modes besides major or minor can give a fresh sound.
For example, if D is the key center using only white notes, you are using
the Dorian mode. It is like D minor, but with B natural, rather than B
flat. I wrote a blues setting of the 130th Psalm using the Dorian mode,
which I sang in church; and I think it was well received. The Dorian mode
occasionally crops up in pop music, as in the Association's "Standing
Still." (Anyone remember the Association?)
Other modes are also effective; but I don't know of anything written in the
mode with B as key center, using all white notes. I can't even find a name
for it in my "Harvard Dictionary of Music." This mode could yield some
peculiar possibilities, with a tonic chord as B D and F natural: a
diminished chord. Would the dominant chord be F major? That is a
diminished fifth up or down from the B. Strange enough to intrigue me.
Each mode has seven possible notes for melodies, plus any other notes the
composer wants to toss in.
Of course there are other scales and harmonic styles, such as the pentatonic
scale (as in "The Banks of Loch Lomond"), the 6-note whole tone scale, and
the 12-note chromatic scale. I've used all these in my own compositions.
Blues has its own system of scale and harmony, which I could write a whole
chapter on, but won't here. As everyone knows, blues uses tones in the
"cracks" between some of the intervals of the chromatic scale--which can be
sung accurately or played accurately on the guitar, but can ordinarily only
be simulated on the piano.
Classical music also has methods for obtaining harmonic and melodic variety.
Towards the end of the 19th century composers like Wagner and Faure expanded
the harmonic language in the area of chromatic modulation and melodic
writing. You may be familiar with Faure's "Requiem," a wonderful piece with
delicious harmonies and melodies--also very emotional and moving. I have
sung it many times in church and in civic chorus concerts. (Another
possible chapter: on chromatic harmony.)
In the 20th century composers like Prokofiev use a technique called
polytonality, which can be applied to both harmonies and melodies.
Prokifiev's most familiar work is "Peter and the Wolf," but he wrote tons of
other terrific music. Polytonality refers to writing in, most often, two
keys at once. (Using more than two keys maybe becomes too complex to be
effective.) Applied to melody, polytonality refers to switching between
usually remote keys in the same melody. I find it difficult to sing
polytonal melodies accurately, but no problem playing them on piano of
guitar.
In popular music, blues and jazz musicians like Count Basie and James Brown
sometimes combine chords like E major and G major, played simultaneously,
yielding a polychord. You can get this chord on the guitar by playing a
standard E 7th chord, but holding down the little finger for a G natural on
the high string. This clashes with the G sharp on a lower string.
You get the idea. I've been planning this post for several days, wondering
whether I should send it, and how to make its length manageable. I won't
feel bad if it's blocked. The topic just interests me a lot.
Best wishes to all,
Ron Hennessy
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Subject: Re: NN: Modes, and "Clock Without Hands"
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 11:07:14 EDT
From: Brimpls@aol.com
rhennesy@coserv.net writes:
> Other modes are also effective; but I don't know of anything written in the
> mode with B as key center, using all white notes. I can't even find a name
> for it in my "Harvard Dictionary of Music." This mode could yield some
> peculiar possibilities, with a tonic chord as B D and F natural: a
> diminished chord. Would the dominant chord be F major? That is a
> diminished fifth up or down from the B. Strange enough to intrigue me.
Hi Ron!
My conservatory days come back to haunt me, tee hee. No, really, the mode
that begins on B and uses only white notes came to be called the Locrian
mode, but is almost never used, so it's really more of an academic exercise.
We had to learn them and sing them, up and down, in theory class. Composing
in Dorian is wonderful, isn't it? I love that one. Your piece in Dorian must
be really wonderful.
If you look in a big music dictionary under "Church Modes," it will explain
the whole Authentic/Plagal distinction and how that "B" mode was once called
Hypophrygian but later was called Locrian.
One of my smaller music dictionaries, the Harper Dictionary of Music, says of
the Locrian mode: "It was not used in composition because the interval
between the final and the fifth note was a diminished fifth instead of a
perfect fifth, a practice not permitted."
It also says of the church modes that "By 1800 the church modes had been
wholly replaced in art music by the major and minor modes (derived from the
Ionian and Aeolian modes), but they reappeared in the nineteenth century when
composers began to take an interest in various kinds of folk music, much of
which is based on scales other than the present major and minor scales."
Which brings us back to folk music, and that's got to be Nanci-related.
I did buy "CWH" last week and have given it a few good listens. So far, my
favorite cuts are the first and last ones, and yes, that string arrangement
does sound very beautiful on "Wee Small Hours." I love that Nanci dedicated
that one to her mother. It will be good to hear Nanci sing some of these
live on the 7th of September here in Minnesota.
Sabrina in Mpls.
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Subject: RE: NN: Modes, and "Clock Without Hands"
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 16:38:20 -0500
From: Ron Hennessy (rhennesy@coserv.net>
Thanks, Sabrina!
I dug a little deeper in my Harvard Dictionary of Music and found mention of
the Locrian Mode.
I think it might do for a movement for string quartet, like "Eleanor Rigby"
gone bananas. Hmm.
Ron Hennessy
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Subject: NN: Re: Melodic Resources
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 11:10:00 -0400
From: DvBGardner@genelogic.com
Ron Hennessy wrote: (((( Donate, I think you were talking about melodies
using the major or minor diatonic scales. Of course there are five other
diatonic scales. To illustrate: the white notes on the piano have seven
different notes, excluding repetitions in different octaves..........>>>>
YIKES, Ron!!!! I did it again, eh? I realized the moment that I
posted that message, that it would cause some people to take issue with
this intentionally oversimplified statement. My apologies. I was once
a classically trained violinist and grew up with classical music and Dixie
jazz/swing in a family of musicians. Although I taught myself piano,
guitar and several instruments other than violin (and I prefer to play
music mostly by ear), I am actually quite familiar with music theory. I
sing both classical and non-classical pieces, including international
folklore (I'm a linguist by my first education).
In addition, the music I have written over the years crosses a variety of
styles -- from folk and spiritual music for guitar, to gospel and choral
pieces; sonatas and blues pieces for piano; rock & raggae pieces for my
youth band ; childrens music for guitar and recorder, as well as some
other contemporary style (e.g., Indigo Girls, Cocteau Twins style) pieces,
etc. etc. -- well, you get the picture. Not all of which has been
performed in public, but one day I plan on gathering it all up and putting
it out there to share....... :):)
Since this list is mainly focused on the folksy side of music, I don't
often refer to my other interests and/or experience in other genres of
music and literary writing, etc. After reading your post, I had to grin
-- -- I must have come across as someone who can only write in the major or
minor scales, all melodic themes perhaps wrapped around the "Twinkle Little
Star" theme. :) I guess I deserve that image after my blonde ditz post.
:) So, your response is tremendously appreciated, Ron, and actually quite
interesting. I am not familiar with Faure's "Requiem" -- Verdi's of
course. I must admit that the romantics and post-romantic era has never
captured my interest as much as baroque and the classics/Vienna classics
did (although my great-great grandfather, Friedrich von Flotow, was a 19th
century composer). Of course, I know all the standard "classics" from
that era, but only a handful of 19th and 20th century composers are
regularly visited in my CD collection -- this is entirely my shortcoming, I
know and this, too, shall change one day when I have time to explore a bit
more. I'll check out Faure as soon as I get home tonight.
One challenge I have yet to master musically, is in the area of jazz (other
than New Orleans style Dixie and Swing). I can easily come up with a jazz
melody but writing the accompaniment would take me a while (if I want to
stick to appropriate jazz standards, that is). This, too, shall be a
project to tackle when I am old enough to have time........ Anyway,
your message was indeed informative, albeit prompted by a wrong impression
(as I said, I deserve that. :). I am quite impressed with your musical
knowledge and I stand humbled and, partially, corrected. Thanks again.
Donate "currently listening to the Trio from Cosi Fan Tutte -- to be
followed by John Martyn. Well, it's Monday morning!" v.B.-G.
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Subject: NN: RE: Re: Melodic Resources
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 16:29:19 -0500
From: Ron Hennessy (rhennesy@coserv.net>
Donate von Bredow-Gardner wrote: (((YIKES, Ron!!!! I did it again, eh?
I realized the moment that I posted that message, that it would cause some
people to take issue with this intentionally oversimplified statement. My
apologies.>>>
Donate, no apology necessary. As I said, I knew you were aware of your
oversimplification. You and any number of other people participating in
this list are more knowledgeable musically than me; so I wasn't presuming to
lecture you.
Your remark about melodies just got me on a train of thought that wouldn't
leave me in peace; so I wrote about it to exorcise it, more for my own
benefit than anyone else's. I also hoped that, because the subject
interested me, my remarks might interest someone else. (I cringe now
rereading it, mostly because of the grammatical slips I can no longer
correct!)
As for Faure's Requiem, you couldn't go wrong with the Robert Shaw
recording, although there are many other good ones. I've also learned to
play over a dozen of Faure's piano pieces, but the Requiem is a good place
to start with this composer.
Your talk about your own compositions intrigues me a lot. I'd love the
opportunity to see and hear a sample of them. If you have the music
printing and reproduction program called Finale, maybe we could arrange to
swap data files of our compositions via email attachments; of course with
the understanding that we would adequately protect each other's intellectual
rights. I have Finale 98.
Best wishes,
Ron Hennessy
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Subject: Re: NN: Nanci at the Botanic Gardens in Denver
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 00:26:22 EDT
From: NanciNetter@aol.com
> She wore tan pants
> with dark, high top boots, some kind of diaphanous transparent top that
> flowed past her knees, topped off with a long turquoise-colored scarf. I
HEY! I'll have you know there are at least TWO Nanci/Stevie fans on this
list!! Blasphemy, indeed!!!
... Would anyone agree that "Late Night Grande Hotel" just begs to be sung
by Stevie?!?! (she's even a big Garbo fan!) It's my Life's passion to
somehow connect Stevie to that song and get her to cover it. Hmm, maybe thru
Sheryl Crow .. Sheryl produced most of Stevie's latest album, and Sheryl went
to Vietnam with Nanci .. anyone out there know Miss Crow?!? (hehe>
Just funnin' witcha, Greg ...
David
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Subject: NN: Nicks/Griffith fans
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 08:02:47 -0400
From: ntricate1@home.com
(waves> Another one here. :)
Well if you can see Stevie singing "Late Night Grande Hotel", I'm
wondering why she & Nanci couldn't do a duet album, lol.
I -do- believe Nanci's the more talented singer/songwriter, though!
Maryann
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